1 [Report This]Date: September 02, 2020 11:33 am Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
Okay, this was the BEST first fight fic I've read and I couldn't NOT comment... This is really incredible. Seriously, in every way. Just... wow. Thank you so much!
Date: March 11, 2009 10:40 am Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
What a great chapter. Totally in-character. It actually felt cathartic for me as well; I always wished that they would hash things out on camera at some point.
Date: February 11, 2009 09:48 pm Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
woah. that was intense. but still really good. i like that Jim isn't perfect here, and neither is Pam. most of what they're fighting about is ridiculous, but it's real and insecure and honest. great job :)
Author's Response: Thanks a lot! I tried to keep the fight as realistic as possible but let both of them cross the line on what's fair to say - they're still learning, after all. :)
10 [Report This]Date: January 07, 2009 11:01 am Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
" You can also say with fair certainty that some sort of epic war is being staged in your reproductive organs"
That is the perfect way to describe it. Which is why I generally threaten to rip out my uterus every month or so.
TMI for a review?
Is it wrong that I sort of like angry!Pam?
Probably because I can so easily relate. This is so like me. Which really makes me wonder how I have any friends left. I am SO not a fun person to be around!
(this was a longer section, but then I decided that was REALLY TMI for a review...)
And I can relate on the indecisiveness. That is why I'm an expert at eeny-meeny-miny-moe.
R-... she wasn't going to say Roy.... she was going to say.... robots. Or rascals. Or.... rodents. Aren't rats just the cutest thing ever?
This was perfect. Jim is human, and arguments are a part of relationships, and, gah, this was perfect even if a bit heartbreaking and I hate them fighting, but they need to fight and so, i'm talking myself in circles now.
Author's Response: Nah, not TMI at all...I'm a chick; I can totally relate. ;) I'm so happy you liked this, despite not enjoying them fighting! :)
Date: December 27, 2008 09:38 pm Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
Wow. Your presentation of the inevitable explosion between Pam and Jim was just amazing. I love how reluctantly they are both drawn into the argument, yet how efficiently they both wound each other. Good arc to the chapter.
Author's Response: Thanks a lot! I tried to build momentum into their blow-up and ease them back out slowly, so I'm glad that worked for you. I appreciate this!
Date: December 21, 2008 06:47 pm Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
I never come to this site, as you know, but I had to see what all the hoopla was about. My friend... this was brilliant to the umpteenth degree. I have always enjoyed Pim, but you breathed life into the couple again with this chapter. I have always enjoyed your writing, as you also know, but you have outdone yourself with this one. It just seemed so organic.
Congrats, pal. You've accomplished something that so many people have tried and failed at, make JAM seem... real again
Author's Response: Well thanks, buddy, I really appreciate that! I can't believe that this got any hoopla, at all, but I'm unbelievably flattered, and I really thank you for taking the time to come on over and check it out. :)
10 [Report This]Date: December 19, 2008 09:28 pm Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
Hi Little Comment--
I haven't been on MTT in lo these 3ish months, but Mose linked me to this chapter of this story and said it was something I needed to see. I have always loved "The Office," and to some degree I always will love it, but the show and I have drifted apart since mid-s4. In some ways, it's like Pam and Roy. We were great together early on, when we were young, but we didn't do well growing old together. I've kind of fallen off the face of the fandom planet, but stories like this just create heat inside me and make me think, "DAMN. THIS is what should have happened." It's as though reading your story is a glimpse into everything I wanted to happen last season that never did. You're right: Jim is great, but he's too perfect, and so is Jam. Stories like this, and the brilliance emanating from this fight, remind me of why fic is wonderful. You have a lot to be proud of here, and I really thank you for bringing me back into the world of Jim and Pam for a conversation that finally seemed real and believable, because for those moments I was reading it, I was reminded of why I loved these characters in the first place.
Bravo, my friend. Bravo! (and sorry to make this an unsolicited CH Story Hour)
-CH
Author's Response: Thank you so much! I'm flattered beyond words that you took the time to check this out, and left such glowing words in your LJ as well. I didn't write this out of dissatisfaction, per se, but out of the need to test myself and let these characters really become three dimensional and cross the lines of what's okay to say...in short, to hash out what HAD to be hashed out in order for them to be real and TOGETHER. I imagine it would have taken awhile, but once the floodgates opened... Anyway, again, a thousand thanks, friend. Glad this was all you wanted it to be. :)
10 [Report This]Date: December 19, 2008 10:34 am Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
That was amazing.Raw and unflinching and just...right. You really got all the moments down there. Excellent job.
Author's Response: Thank you so much - I'm really glad you enjoyed it. :)
Date: December 19, 2008 08:13 am Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
One of the most realistic fights I've read. Sometimes when the flood gates are opened they can't be stopped. You really did a wonderful job.
Author's Response: Thanks, KH, and I agree - you know when THAT line's been crossed, and yet sometimes the hits just keep on coming. :)
Date: December 18, 2008 11:30 pm Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
That was an incredibly realistic fight. I feel like with many writers who take on a JAM fight, I can sort of see which way the fence is leaning, you know what I mean? But I feel like with this, you really made a concerted effort to tell both side of the story and I truly felt for both of them in this. Very realistic inciting incidents...bad day, the comment about decisions in the salad aisle. lol. Great, great stuff here.
Author's Response: Thanks, LoveFool! I really did try to keep this as balanced as possible, and tried to make especially certain that neither of them was the "good guy." Because in real life, there's usually no winner and no innocent party. I'm really glad you took the time to read and that it didn't disappoint.
Date: December 18, 2008 03:39 pm Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
Holy hell, woman!!!!! Whhhyyyy did it take me so long to read this???? I was so blown away by it. Everything--the narration, the dialogue, the flow of it all--was ridiculously amazing. I just don't know what else to say. It was perfect. There. It was perfection, and I'm sorry I didn't get to read it sooner. This is my favorite of the story, of your writing, maybe of all fics ever. Phenomenal.
Wow, you've lowered me to button status. I didn't think that was possible, but apparently it is.
Author's Response: Um...wow. Thank you. So much. It means more than you know, because...because you're you. Thanks. *hug* :)
10 [Report This]Date: December 18, 2008 12:04 pm Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
I hate to quibble with you, but this? This is totally important, and definitely an adventure. This is, by far, the best "hashing out the past" fight fic I've read. Just stunningly perfect, because of course all of that is "so... there".
Author's Response: (Never be afraid to quibble - but that's why there's that "usually" in the title. ;) ) Thank you so very much. I'm really, really touched. :)
10 [Report This]Date: December 18, 2008 11:46 am Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
Whew.
Mose finally exhales.
Okay, see, THIS is what I wanted. THIS is exactly how it should have (and probably did) happen. And THIS is why I could never write a convincing Jim/Pam argument to save my life.
Because you allowed this fight to breathe, gave it room to throw punches and get knocked down. You didn't retreat to "I'm sorry I love you let's have wild makeup sex before the fangirls start to cry." You just let it happen. Organically. Logically. Rationally. (And irrationally). Like a real fight between real people, you just let them go at it. And it was fantastic to witness.
The 2nd person narrative structure is a personal favorite of mine, and the PERFECT choice for a scene like this. It seems so much easier to convey exactly what the person is feeling when seen through that type of lens.
I'll echo the sentiment about the "you don't know how to fight with him" line as summing up so much of what their relationship was about at that moment, but for me, everything crystalized with this passage right here:
"Time had not healed these wounds; it had actually done the reverse. You had both lived with these tiny miseries every day and gotten used to them; having them laid out now, when you’re both finally happy, amplifies their ability to hurt you"
I mean... just... GAH. That is practiaclly SATURATED in truth. It's quite literally dripping all over my keyboard. ;)
Out of the park, do you hear me? Knocked. This. Out. Of. The. Park.
Author's Response: Okay, first Katie, now you...you both literally had me choked up. Everything, EVERYTHING I was trying so hard to express and achieve you pointed out and...yeah. I have the good sense to just blush, thank you a LOT, and offer you too a *hug*. :)
10 [Report This]Date: December 17, 2008 11:54 pm Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
SO MANY things to say. So, I will get started :)
Pam's Terrible, Horrible, No-Good Very Bad Day is the perfect example of how she falls back into her habit of not speaking up right away then allows things to go and go and go until she just... can't take it anymore.
this relationship is somehow untouchable
totally describes what I think they might have been expecting (getting together being the end of the problems instead of the beginning of the hard work that relationships take).
The Jim lines re:croutons from “ooo-kay,” on are great. I think you nailed his voice and habit of pushing only enough to say he made an effort, and not enough to try and solve the problem. He seems to be the sort of person who would point out problems and let them go without resolution.
You know he didn’t mean his joke that way
Totally, but what Pam gets and you centered the fic around is that jokes like that are only funny when there's a dead serious topic at the centre. You picked such a good offhand statement to pin the whole fic on. OTOH, I probably shouldn't be surprised that you picked out a little comment like that considering your username, lol.
Because I don’t want you to have bad days
Love when Jim comes up with a truthful pithy statement like that. He could have dressed it up, but he didn't. Nice.
apparently even he is susceptible to that guy tendency to chalk up bad moods and hurt feelings to PMS
lol. Poor male half of the population, no matter how hard they try there's always this one crazy factor they don't know when to consider or need to figure out if it's something THEY did.
“You sound so…put upon. Like I’m just too much to deal with today. I’m sorry I’m moody, but you sound like R—“
Excellent. Sometimes I think Pam must think she's needier than Jim, so growing to realize she isn't then trying to deal with things would totally trigger her. And I love how both of them seem to realize that saying he's like Roy is simply a shortcut for saying what he's ACTUALLY doing that bothers her. Like not having to be specific about it. Hopefully what I just wrote makes sense.
“He did care about me,” you whisper.
See, you can't write off Roy without writing off Pam as well. Jim, sometimes... well, you're just human.
You’re asking me to just write off any of my life that didn’t involve you
"I have faith enough to know that ultimately… you made the choice to be with me
“So it was all or nothing, and you chose to give me nothing. For months.”
Best Jim/Pam conversation lines ever.
having them laid out now, when you’re both finally happy, amplifies their ability to hurt you
awesome to bring that up. IMHO bringing them up when you've got more at risk (like you mentioned, when they're pretty happy overall) shows how important they are... so I'm proud of them for doing it now.
Liked Jim admitting he still holds the "before" in the back of his mind in his romantic relationship with her. Yet he still informs her that she shouldn't. Oh young Jim, so much still to learn. But we love you anyway.
Jim having the guts to ask about good times with Roy was one hundred percent win. What's so great about her choosing you if the one before was an inconsiderate boor? This seems to be the first truly adult relationship for both. At least in ficdom.
Things that made me lol:
it’s fantasy, as in not real (actually that got more of a *snicker*)
you make him wait, which he proceeds to do like a five year old
neither of you instigate making love
TY for no makeup sex. Not that I'm against it, just that there was so much else that needed to be resolved first. And makeup sex would have sort of overshadowed everything else.
I liked getting the inside scoop on how they learned to argue with each other- if they didn't then they'd be pretty boring. And probably broken up sooner or later.
I love flawed!Jim stories- his faults are show with great subtlety on the show for the most part, but I can see them being a huuuuuge problem when they do come to the surface.
Also, lol at Jim not being embarrassed about Pam's Midol... idk why I find that endearing. My Jim!love extends to the silliest things, I tell you.
This is so so good. A-maaaaa-zing!
Author's Response: Wow. Well first off, thanks for such an amazing and detailed review. I so love seeing my stuff through other's eyes. I can't possible respond to every insightful thing you've said, but know that all your points assured me I'd done what I set out to here, and you saw things I myself hadn't planned but do work. I really appreciate this; thank you again. :)
Date: December 17, 2008 07:57 pm Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
Fascinating. Truly. This had me thinking in all kinds of ways about the things Jim and Pam have left unsaid, all their residual scars. Because at this point in time they'd been apart longer than they'd been together. During much of that time they were unknowingly hurting each other, and the past has a way of sneaking up on you. Or maybe it's always there, and you can only ignore it for so long. That's what I got out of this, anyway.
How appropriate for their fight to start with a seemingly harmless comment with deeper implications. Because it's never really about the croutons, is it? That's how it happens so often in real life.
You don’t know how to fight with Jim.
Yes, yes, yes. That is something I've always said about relationships. It takes time, but you've got to learn how to fight with each other. They're just starting out, and making all kinds of mistakes, which is so, so true.
There all sorts of brilliant observations in here -- about Jim and Pam, about life, about love. So many that if I start quoting them all, I'll just end up copying and pasting the whole thing. Why is it just as satisfying to read an angsty fight like this as it is to read steam or fluff (or fluffy steam)? I don't know what it is, but whatever it is, you're good at it.
Author's Response: Thank you so much! I agree with so much of what you point out - that so many things get left unsaid, for better or worse; that you do have to kearn to fight (and that that's not dysfunctional, it's actually healthy); that it's NEVER just croutons. I really appreciate your taking the time to say all this; thanks again. :)
Date: December 17, 2008 06:04 pm Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
Wow that was AMAZING. I felt for both Jim and Pam there, and I am usually very pro Jim, but I put myself in Pam's possition and I could see it from her POV as well. Brilliantl done as usual.
Author's Response: Thanks! I usually find it much easier to get in Jim's head, but here I decided to try Pam's; I'm glad it worked for you. :)
Date: December 17, 2008 04:04 pm Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
I loved this chapter.
It felt so normal, a fight that starts out as something stupid and only gets out of control because of some stupid hormones or a bad day and nobody really meant anything and you say what will hurt the most because you're angry and we've all done that so many times that everyone understands and it's the truth.
And I'm totally with you. I get annoyed when Pam is portrayed as the All American Sweetheart who everyone falls instantly in love with and Jim is the perfect sex god who isn't afraid to cry. The reason this pairing works so well is because they're authentic and "real" and this chapter portrays that.
Nicely done. Looking forward to the next one.
Author's Response: Thank you, Pigeon! I tried to keep it real, as the kids say. It does seem that so often the big fights are started by something so small. I'm not a fan of super perfect/super amazing!Jim and Pam, because while they're cute and have a great dynamic, they're just two characters that have always been very real. Thanks a lot for your kind words. :)
10 [Report This]Date: December 17, 2008 01:03 pm Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
Second person is tough stuff, so let me start by saying that I read this twice before I even noticed it, that's how subtle and well-constructed this is. Hats off. Oh, and, also? I read this twice. Well, three times.
I could spend many, many lines quoting you back at you, but there's just one little detail I want to point out, as I think it's indicative of one of your talents: you don't explicitly identify who's speaking in the first paragraph, which is, of course, fine. Then I got to the last sentence - if there’s something you can’t stand, it’s being unprepared. - and I thought, oh, it's Pam. Again, so subtly in character. I'm seriously, seriously impressed.
And, finally -
Brought to you by The Little Comment Society For Make Jim Halpert Less Perfect While Still Jimtastic.
YES. Where do I sign up?
Author's Response: Consider your membership card issued, my friend - and may I say that such nice words from a talented writer like you really touched me? As for the voice/POV, the piece just chooses its own for me, always...I just start with the idea and whatever voice I start with, I use. Thanks for noting all those small details, and just...thanks for such a great review!
Date: December 17, 2008 10:19 am Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
That. was. so. INTENSE! Seriously, my nails are shorter after reading this, but it was so well done! And of course isn't that how all the massive fights begin, over something really stupid? But the transition and flow into the bigger, epic fight was seamless. You should be really proud of this one.
Author's Response: Yikes! I didn't mess up a manicure or anything, did I? :) Anyway, thanks new friend! That is how they aways start, in my oh-so-humble opinion. I'm so happy that you thought the transition was clear and flowed well; it was one of my biggest concerns. Thank you so much again!
Date: December 17, 2008 08:50 am Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
Oh LC this one hurts, in a really really brilliant way. It feels so unbelievably real, the way it spirals from nothing major into something huge and it's so real for them, it's exactly what I'd see them fighting about, especially if, as I always imagine, they didn't deal with all the Roy and Karen stuff early on. I got really drawn into this, to the point that I actually winced when she almost compared him to Roy.
Wonderful :)
Author's Response: Thank you, SS! I winced too, in writing and rereading, but I'm so happy you still enjoyed it. YOU'RE the brilliant one! :)
Date: December 17, 2008 08:35 am Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
This is terrific. The emotions, the characterizations, the dialogue are all amazingly realistic and vivid. All the things that had to be said to go forward. I particularly like all the small details of interaction, like this: You get up too and walk with him to the couch. You take opposite sides, because this is still going on and you still need a little space.
Well done.
Author's Response: Thank you so much - from a talent like you, this is extra-flattering! :D I'm glad you appreciated that detail - I was so conscious of easing them into, then out of the fight...not just a kiss and a cute joke and that's that. Thanks again!
Date: December 17, 2008 07:20 am Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
Yeah, there must have been some sort of knock-down drag out that took place off camera -- three seasons and who knows how many years of baggage doesn't just magically float away like a bad haircut.
The level of detail of where the mind goes when you're fighting is so realistic it kind of hurts a little. Nicely done, LC.
Interesting that this chapter is more than twice as long as the other fluffy ones. Hmm...
Author's Response: Thank you so much, Lisa...it hurt me too. I was reading aloud to test it and I was actually flinching. But it had to happen, and I had to try it, so...yeah. I'm really glad you liked it. :) (And I noticed that length thing too...what is that? Sad thing is, I could've kept up with this for a lot longer...oh cripes, YES, TWSS.) ;)
Date: December 17, 2008 07:05 am Title: Nothing Hurts Like Your Mouth
Wow, LC, that was fantastic--even without make-up sex!. I'm exhausted; I can't even begin to imagine how you felt. Glad to hear Mr. Comment is OK! You made me enjoy being an invisible witness to their fight. Quite an accomplishment : )
Author's Response: Thanks, buddy! It WAS exhausting, because I truly got method (so corny), and it left me irritable for HOURS. I did really feel for Mr. C, but he's a trooper. ;) Oh what we do for fanfic...